COVID-19

[subway14]

Man escapes quarantine hotel in Perth by scaling rope made of tied together BED SHEETS from fourth floor window

[seso]

In Wales, 93% of adults have antibodies against COVID-19, i.e. they either have had a COVID-19 vaccine or were positive for COVID-19 in the past.

This means that, for a country of 3.2 million people, it takes 7-16 months for [almost] the entire population to develop antibodies against a virus when you don't have many social restrictions and you have a full vaccination programm on (the first cases were detected in March 2020 and mass vaccinations started in December 2020).

Before this started, I would have thought that just by 'social interaction' people would be positive for such a virus much faster.

[subway14]

Man with Covid-19 is caught wearing a niqab and pretending to be his WIFE after boarding a flight in Indonesia

And I bet he put his wife in a suitcase.

[EarlofBug]

Was there a clinical trial that showed that non-vaccinated people are more infecting than vaccinated people?

[Club-Mate]

Was there a clinical trial that showed that non-vaccinated people are more infecting than vaccinated people?

earlier or later you'll find even these datas published but it will take some time. Almost every day new statistics show up so very laboriuos to follow it. But here is something similar within this chapter.

https://www.heute.at/s/so-viele-mensche ... -100153841

Very low number of covid patients after full immunization were reported today in medias here. "According to statistics around one in 10,000 people who are vaccinated falls ill according to figures from the Federal Office of Public Health".

[EarlofBug]

Yes, the vaccines decreases serious illness. But how much the vaccination decreases the infection rates, if any?

[bbi]

I saw some report on the amount of virus in vaccinated vs non vaccinated people breath/saliva ... (obviously confirmed cases). it was something 3/6 time smaller for a vaccinated person which would result in that person being less infectious, but with out having a clear scale. also should add to this what is the probability of the 2 groups to get even that slight infection where they just become contagious.

I think it is to soon to have any such data because this is more of a statistic analysis, and you we might have some estimations later one, but not right now as cases are starting to rise in the countries that actually have a good vaccination rate.
personally I think they will use for the analysis the different impact the new wave will have in different countries with different percentage. Bulgaria-12, romania - 25, serbia - 40 ...

[scpgt]

New study published today claim that fully vaccinated catch the virus 3times less than non-vaccinated
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/d ... s-24683042

That "studies" seem to be 'on order', appearing exactly at the right time, in order to put pressure on non-vaccinated people, as vaccination is going now into a period of slackness

On the other hand, that incident occurred few weeks ago, as a delegation of Democrats traveling to Washington DC became a super spreader event, infecting even VP Harris other people in the White House as well, all of them fully-vaccinated
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/spencerbr ... c-n2592799

I dont understand why should it be taken as evidence the impact in different countries with different percentage, and not taking in consideration already the fact that UK and Israel, which were the model few months ago, have now rising infection numbers. So, mass vaccination doesnt stop spreading of the virus whatsoever.

[bbi]

I dont understand why should it be taken as evidence the impact in different countries with different percentage, and not taking in consideration already the fact that UK and Israel, which were the model few months ago, have now rising infection numbers. So, mass vaccination doesnt stop spreading of the virus whatsoever.

well if we would have a control population, no vaccine no exposure to the coranavirus before hand. we could see what the infection rate would be and compare.

considering what happened in India one can expect that the delta version spreads much more easily. so probably the rates we see now in England Israel would have been much higher without the vaccine. hard to prove right now, but we will get a clearer picture in about 2 months I think.

[EarlofBug]

In Israel, people over 60 y.o can get a 3td dose of pfizer vaccine. Both of my parents (66 and 63 yo) got a 3rd dose yesterday.

[EarlofBug]

Some exact numbers crunch time!
In Israel, there are about 5.4 mil people that were vaccinated with at least 2 doses of the pfizer vaccine (since December). 5.8 mil people were vaccinated with at least one dose, out of a population of around 9.3 mil!
(Around 300,000 got 3 doses of the vaccine).
That means that 58% of the general population were vaccinated with at least 2 doses, and 62% of the population were vaccinated with at least one dose.

Now, out of around 280 serious or critical cases in Israel right now, about 65% of them were vaccinated with 2 doses of the pfizer vaccine! Only around 34% of the serious or critical cases (as WHO calls them) were not vaccinated with at least 2 doses.

So, the numbers of the serious and critical cases of vaccinated people, out of all the seriously ill and infected people, is higher than the percentage of the vaccinated people in the general population!

These numbers shows clearly that the current pfizer vaccines that are being administrated are not affective!

Note: It doesn't take into account the age of the vaccinated and seriously ill, and when were the vaccines given.

[greenbay]

Was there a clinical trial that showed that non-vaccinated people are more infecting than vaccinated people?

There is no need for a clinical trial.

People who carry a bigger virus load are more infectious than people who carry a lower virus load. That's virus 101.

Now assume person V (vaccinated) and person N (not vaccinated) get infected with the same virus load.

The virus load in their bodies will instantly start to double, quadruple etc.

While person N's immune system will need several days for developing an answer from scratch, person V's immune reaction starts with only a short delay. As person V's immune system already knows the virus, no need to start from scratch. Even if the virus has evolved into a beta, gamma, delta version, the immune system of person V has a head start as it only needs to adapt, not start from scratch.

Result: At any given time in the next days, person N will carry a way bigger virus load than person V. Therefore person N will be more infectious, spreading the virus more easily than person V.

[bbi]

So, the numbers of the serious and critical cases of vaccinated people, out of all the seriously ill and infected people, is higher than the percentage of the vaccinated people in the general population!

that is worrying. but again while the numbers are true we also need to understand how to interpret them and if you can explain or not anomalies.

Also what I care more about is the number of deaths which even in Israel seems better than before. Now the 7 day moving average is 3000. in december 24 had a similar 7 day moving average. and the ascending curve was very similar. The deaths 7 day moving average is now at 7 and in december at 17. so it does show an improvement even if it's the exact same conditions. we'll have a better view in a month.

Other countries show the improvement from vaccination in the number of deaths vs number of new infection. UK has about 80% infections while death are at 6% compared to the last wave. And other countries with very high number of new cases show similarities to UK.

Also just analyzing this way doesn't take into account the new strain differences. even if you keep the same numbers it could mean the vaccine is helpful if the virus became worse. and than you can also take into account natural immunity for person which already got infected before.

[EarlofBug]

So, the numbers of the serious and critical cases of vaccinated people, out of all the seriously ill and infected people, is higher than the percentage of the vaccinated people in the general population!

that is worrying. but again while the numbers are true we also need to understand how to interpret them and if you can explain or not anomalies.

Also what I care more about is the number of deaths which even in Israel seems better than before. Now the 7 day moving average is 3000. in december 24 had a similar 7 day moving average. and the ascending curve was very similar. The deaths 7 day moving average is now at 7 and in december at 17. so it does show an improvement even if it's the exact same conditions. we'll have a better view in a month.

Also just analyzing this way doesn't take into account the new strain differences. even if you keep the same numbers it could mean the vaccine is helpful if the virus became worse. and than you can also take into account natural immunity for person which already got infected before.

Yes, the numbers that I've put in the above post doesn't tell the entire picture. When you look at differeng age groups, vaccined vs. non-vaccined people, the percentage of non-vaccined people from a certain age group that got seriously ill is way higher than the number of the vaccined people from the same age group that is seriously ill.
So the current vaccines may help. We need to keep watching and check the stats and the numbers in the near future, maybe in 2 months.

[levski_ole]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/fake- ... ar-AAN34TD

Luckily nowadays you can buy anything if you have the money. So if the governments keep violating human rights by asking for your papers (see the movie Casablanca), the above option could be very viable for some segment of the population.