babaluj1 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 03:16
Is it better to play in EL or in ECL? It depends on which club it is. For Big 5 league clubs, it is definitely better to play in EL because they will earn more there. Maybe for Portuguese clubs, possibly Dutch ones. In EL, the market pool is huge at around 140 million euros and it mostly goes to Top 5 league clubs. For clubs in weaker leagues it is definitely better to play in the ECL for the simple reason that they are too weak for the EL. Which clubs will mostly go through in the knockout phase, second-placed ECL or third-placed EL? Certainly the third-placed ELs are stronger than the second-placed ECLs, in 8 direct collisions at least 5 or 6 third-placed ELs will pass. Realistically, the last in the EL groups would be in the fight for the passage of the group, and even a victory in the ECL group.
Who will take more points for the coefficient and earn more money, so it will certainly be on average those first-placed and second-placed ECL compared to third and fourth-placed EL, unless it is the Top 5 league clubs that will earn millions from the market pool in EL.
The group winner wins an average of 10 points for the odds, the runner-up 8, the third-place finisher 4 and the fourth-place finisher 2 points, plus 2 more bonus points for the group winner and 1 bonus point in the ECL for the runner-up. In order for the third-placed EL with 4 points to reach the second-placed ECL with 9 points, it should reach at least the quarterfinals, and to catch the 12 points of the group winner, it needs approximately the semifinals.
it is obvious that if you are pretty certain that you can survive in europe league you play in europe league
That is not the discussion in my eyes.
The discussion is : you are not a top team and also not a very weak team.
You are a team that if you play europe league you have 50 % to crash or if you play conference league you have 85 % of going through.
What is the choice ?
If the club has about a 50% chance in the EL of passing the group then it is definitely better to play the Europa League. There is higher earnings and higher coefficients. What is debatable are clubs that have a 20% or 10% or less chance of passing the EL group, while in the ECL they would have a 50 or 60% chance of passing the group. Most of the clubs that will pass the ECL group would win fourth or at best third places in the EL. The only exceptions are Roma and Tottenham, who would be favorites to pass in the EL as well.
Long-term for a club, it is always best to play in the CL.
You get the money, you increase exponentially your chances to build a league dynasty since you get a financial advantage, you repeat it, and repeat it, and at some points you will have a team good enough and a draw good enough to either make it to the round of 16 or start finishing consistently 3rd and look for something big in the EL.
Overgame wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 13:13
Lille did "beat" #7, #19 and #40. I don't like kurt's comment but right now you are just displaying a level of bad faith over 9000.
It's not the forum member kurt, it's Dirk Kuyt, the former football player.
Kuyt is an idiot.
Very hard working though. I wish all footballer's had his work-rate and resolve.
it is obvious that if you are pretty certain that you can survive in europe league you play in europe league
That is not the discussion in my eyes.
The discussion is : you are not a top team and also not a very weak team.
You are a team that if you play europe league you have 50 % to crash or if you play conference league you have 85 % of going through.
What is the choice ?
If the club has about a 50% chance in the EL of passing the group then it is definitely better to play the Europa League. There is higher earnings and higher coefficients. What is debatable are clubs that have a 20% or 10% or less chance of passing the EL group, while in the ECL they would have a 50 or 60% chance of passing the group. Most of the clubs that will pass the ECL group would win fourth or at best third places in the EL. The only exceptions are Roma and Tottenham, who would be favorites to pass in the EL as well.
The 2nd pot in ECL is similar to the 3rd pot in EL (coefficient wise).
it is obvious that if you are pretty certain that you can survive in europe league you play in europe league
That is not the discussion in my eyes.
The discussion is : you are not a top team and also not a very weak team.
You are a team that if you play europe league you have 50 % to crash or if you play conference league you have 85 % of going through.
What is the choice ?
If the club has about a 50% chance in the EL of passing the group then it is definitely better to play the Europa League. There is higher earnings and higher coefficients. What is debatable are clubs that have a 20% or 10% or less chance of passing the EL group, while in the ECL they would have a 50 or 60% chance of passing the group. Most of the clubs that will pass the ECL group would win fourth or at best third places in the EL. The only exceptions are Roma and Tottenham, who would be favorites to pass in the EL as well.
The 2nd pot in ECL is similar to the 3rd pot in EL (coefficient wise).
I think the difference between EL and ECL is quite big in the strength of the teams, something like the difference between CL and EL. Most third-placed ELs should pass the second-placed ECLs in the knockout phase, after which some third-placed ECLs will also knock out the some winners of the ECL groups.
If the club has about a 50% chance in the EL of passing the group then it is definitely better to play the Europa League. There is higher earnings and higher coefficients. What is debatable are clubs that have a 20% or 10% or less chance of passing the EL group, while in the ECL they would have a 50 or 60% chance of passing the group. Most of the clubs that will pass the ECL group would win fourth or at best third places in the EL. The only exceptions are Roma and Tottenham, who would be favorites to pass in the EL as well.
The 2nd pot in ECL is similar to the 3rd pot in EL (coefficient wise).
I think the difference between EL and ECL is quite big in the strength of the teams, something like the difference between CL and EL. Most third-placed ELs should pass the second-placed ECLs in the knockout phase, after which some third-placed ECLs will also knock out the some winners of the ECL groups.
Coefficient wise, no. You arer basically saying "team with around 20 coefficient points from EL will trash teams with around 20 coefficient points from ECL". Geez.
Major difference? No cannon fodder on EL while in ECL you have around 12 teams that hardly will fight for top 2.
Plus, almost no top 5 league's teams on ECL.
paddymcp wrote: ↑Fri Aug 20, 2021 01:48
Does anyone have a graph of what the CL/EL/ECL groups look like as it stands?
Key points: -Lincoln Red Imps are 1 place away from being in pot 3. -UEFA are "free" to decide if they want to place Pacos de Ferreira in pot 2 and Santa Clara in pot 3 or if they want to hold an extra draw before the draw. -With weakened Qarabag in pot 1 we can have absolutely silly groups, ones that resemble a group from the CIS Cup. With the abundance of ex-USSR teams maybe even literally.
If all the winners and teams that drew away advance:
Slavia losing to Legia may be the only chance for city rivals Sparta to climb to Pot 3. And that may even not be enough if Ferencvaros knocks out Young Boys.
amirbachar wrote: ↑Fri Aug 20, 2021 15:15
Pacos de Ferreira finished 5th and SantaClara finished 6th last year, therefor Pacos de Ferreira will be ranked above them, that's the rule.
If two or more clubs or associations are ranked equally, the following criteria are applied, in the order given, to determine their final rankings:
their coefficients in the most recent of the seasons on which the rankings are based;
their coefficients in the next most recent season in which they are not equal;
amirbachar wrote: ↑Fri Aug 20, 2021 15:15
Pacos de Ferreira finished 5th and SantaClara finished 6th last year, therefor Pacos de Ferreira will be ranked above them, that's the rule.
You just took the words out of my mouth. Exactly this
